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Objection 1

Objection: Dan Mohler's teaching is false because he teaches that Jesus wasn't God during His time on earth. (Dan robs Jesus of His divinity during His time on earth.)


Thoughts: Does Dan Mohler believe that Jesus was God during His time on earth? Among the following comments are a several comments that clearly indicate that he does: [Bracketed words are added for clarity/context.]


From HCSKL 2010:
  • Day 3 @ 49:20 - "He [Jesus] is the 'tada' of God Almighty - God in the flesh."
  • Day 5 @ 1:21:32 - "There is only one who can mediate between God and man, the Man - capital “M” - He’s Man. He’s God."
  • Day 8 @ 1:52:50 - [Jesus' words to Dan:] "'Dan, I cried often when I walked the earth, in the flesh like this, crying for people created in My image who have no clue.'... And...I [Dan] realized... He came to His own and they received Him not. The world was created through Him and they knew Him not [see John 1:10-11]. The Truth was standing in front of them and they couldn't see past the lie."
  • Day 14 @5:35 - "Jesus is the fullness of the Godhead bodily." [Teaching on Col. 2:9]
  • Day 14 @1:22:00 - "Don't let the Godhead confuse you... They are God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit but they are one."
  • Day 20 @1:41:15 - "'... and the Word was God.'... Who is he talking about? The Word made flesh."
  • Day 24 @ 1:25:45 - "He didn't come expecting you to bow down and serve Him and honor Him as God." [Implying that He is God but is not expecting that kind of treatment.]
  • Day 25 @0:39 - "Jesus was a man. He was God but He came as a man in the flesh and took on the likeness of sinful flesh and gave His body..."
  • Day 25 @47:08 - [Dan imagines Jesus speaking from the cross] "He's not saying, 'Oh, you dummy. You'll never get it.' He's saying, 'You're created in my image and I believe that you'll get it and I'm dying for you. So how about getting up and living.'"
  • Day 36 @11:58 - [Dan imagines the Syrophoenician woman speaking to Jesus] "But I believe that You love everyone... Everyone is created in Your image."
  • Day 36 @18:45 - "We have access to God because a man is there. And yet He is God. That's amazing."
  • Day 41 @25:35 - "The will of God is only ever found through the life of Jesus. He is the will of God revealed. He is the "tada" of God. God came out like He is through Jesus. He put flesh on Jesus and sent Him as an ambassador of the Father. He's the full expression of His image and person..."
  • Day 41 @26:06 - "You cannot allow a belief in your life that can't be found in the life of Jesus because He's not just Word only, He's power. So He gave us His Word and then sent Him in human form and demonstrated it. So it's Word in action. So the life of Jesus is the action of God. It's God putting the Word into action. It's the Word becoming flesh and dwelling among us... And now we know God through the Word that lives. You can't look anywhere else."
  • Day 42 @1:08:05 - [Jesus at Lazarus' tomb] He is standing there - the resurrection and life and all they can see is death.
  • Day 42 @1:09:03 - [Jesus at Lazarus' tomb] He's standing face to face with people made in the image of God and they can't see God [Jesus] because of the lie - and He is standing right there in the flesh - and speaking out of His mouth - into their tangible, audible ears. And they can't hear or see.
  • Day 42 @1:09:45 - [Jesus at Lazarus' tomb] He's face to face, as a man, with a people made in His image. Those people weren't made unless they were made through Him.

From HCSKL 2011:
  • Day 1 @48:20 - "They could hear the authority in what He was saying but they couldn't receive Him - hear Him - believe Him - and they finally crucified Him as a heretic and a blasphemer. And He was the Word made flesh. Their minds were so contrary to truth that when Truth spoke, they couldn't even hear it."
  • Day 1 @53:40 - "The author and giver of life is ready to go into the realm of death and die - once, for all - and face death... He's eternal. He's Life. He made Himself of no reputation. Now He's going in to face death so that none of us ever die."
  • Day 1 @1:11:55 - "Why don't we look in the mirror... and say, 'Jesus, you should have died for them, because you created them in your image. And what they were living before you came is nothing like your image. Man, thanks for seeing the value in their life.'"
  • Day 1 @1:08:53 - "He's coming from the heavenly realm. He makes Himself of no reputation - putting on flesh - God who can't be tempted - now comes as a man and is tempted at every point."
  • Day 1 @2:14:03 - "If man knew ahead of time and understood that the Son of God was about to be born, how they would have catered to Mary and rolled out the red carpet... [And Holy Spirit explains to Mary & Joseph], 'It's Me [my doing]. I put the Son of God in there.'"
  • Day 1 @2:17:40 - "You can tell, in the life of Jesus, that He doesn't even them [the disciples] to do the "Whoa" thing - even though He's the Son of God. He want them to follow Him.
  • Day 1 @2:19:30 - [Imagining Peter's reaction to foot washing] "You're the Lord - the Christ - the Messiah - the Son of God - and you are going to wash my feet? I don't think so."
  • Day 1 @2:20:24 - "So He made Himself... That means He emptied Himself of His privileges." [Not His Personhood, but how He chose to function.]
  • Day 2 @1:15:08 - [Jesus healing withered hand / Reasons why healing can't happen] He's not intimidated by that. He's the Truth. He's the Christ. He's the the Son of God.
  • Day 2 @2:21:24 - [Selling out truths with little negative thoughts] "It's like we are programmed to believe the lie and the Truth is screaming from a tree [Jesus on the cross], 'I love you. You're amazing. You are created in my image. Your life lived is worth my death. I'm going to rise and justify you. It is finished. You are sons and daughters. Rise up and be free.'"
  • Day 3 @2:38 - Jesus is the Truth - the Truth. He's the truth about life, the Father, you. Nothing was made that wasn't made through Him. He came to His own. The trouble is His own knew Him not and received Him not. But He came to His own. Who's that? It's us.
  • Day 3 @1:43:35 - He is THE Truth, not a truth.
  • Day 5 @10:54 - Thank you for your Word, God. Your Word was made flesh. You came and dwelt among us.
  • Day 5 @52:58 - That's a common thought - that Jesus came to reveal His deity...
  • Day 13 @2:13:20 - [Teaching from Mark 5] "And what Jesus is saying is, “You talk different than me, but yet I created you in My image and you are called to be my sons. But you talk different than Me. You say this, but I say this.”
  • Day 13 @2:13:55 - "And here's the Truth in flesh and blood - the Word made flesh - the Truth. And He says, 'Isn't it amazing that you are created in my image - and you're predestined for my glory - but you say...'"
  • Day 19 @34:40 - "The life of Jesus is God’s will revealed. He's God in the flesh. He’s the word of God with a body."
  • Day 19 @1:40:00 - [Raising Lazarus] - "He's weeping because of the peril of the fall of man and just how lost man is in darkness and that Light itself is standing there and [yet] darkness is dominating their souls. Truth is standing there and lies are dominating. Life is standing there and death is reigning. And they are His people, made in His image. And nothing looks alike right now. [The people don't look anything like God's image now.] And He groans inside."
  • Day 21 @2:01:07 - [Freaking out over betrayal - Judas, Peter] "Could you ever hear Jesus say that [freaking out to His disciples]? Why would you ever hear you say that? You're made in His image. He's THE Truth. "
  • Day 22 @6:42 - "John the baptist had a hard time... knowing that it was Jesus in the flesh - the Son of God in the flesh. And he said, 'You want me to baptize you?'"
  • Day 22 @1:13:37 - "If you bring Jesus into the picture and it sounds silly, it ought to sound silly if we're in there because we're in His image.
  • Day 22 @2:18:15 - "But if you can't find it in the mouth or life of Jesus, why is it in our mouth, if He's in us and we're in His image?"
  • Day 33 @30:13 - "One of the biggest mistakes we've made on the earth and in churches is we still... all we see Him as is God but He came as a man."
  • Day 35 @24:11 - "Jesus is saying, 'Man, I created you for a purpose - to bear witness of my image. Even though you lost that through the fall, I took the fall, rose from the dead, to get it back inside of you. Now, go do what you were created to do, bear witness of my image.'"
  • Day 40 @15:59 - "...taking on the mind of God [clearly referring to Jesus], who laid down His life and made Himself of no reputation.

From Various Other Teachings:

Dan Mohler - Praise Community Church (November 2014):
  • @10:11 - "It's an amazing reality that God put on flesh and died on a cross to pay the price for what flesh failed."
  • @36:30 - "And here is this Jesus, who is God, who has become flesh for some reason... Now He is being butchered and battered..."
Dan Mohler - Deny Yourself @New Life - 2 - Sunday 9am - May 2015:
  • @15:04 - "Do you guys believe that Jesus was really a real fellow. That He came as God in the flesh?"
HCSKL 2017 Reveal - Session 11 (not made public by HC)
  • @1:47:45 - [Raising Lazurus] "He's not crying because Lazarus died. He's face to face with the fall of man and He is the Resurection and Life. He's Life - and all the people can see - that are made through Him and made for His image - all the people can see is death. And Life is standing right in front of them."
  • @1:48:47 - [Raising Lazurus] "He [Jesus] was grieving because the people that were made in His image could only see death, in the presence of Life."
Dan Mohler - Friday Night - Awake Church (9/2017):
  • @6:40 - "He's inside a woman for about 9 months and He is God the whole time... from the beginning..."
Power and Love Conference May 2018 Dan Mohler: from 11:05 to 15:30
  • @14:02 - "The King of the universe was sitting in there for nine months crock potting in a woman."
  • @14:58 - "Is He Lord? Yes. Is He God? Yes. Is He Name above every name? Yes. But He is a Man. He has a body. And the blood of a Man is in the Holy Place."
@ Central Assembly of God - 2 - Communion - April 2018:
  • @7:04 - "It's the heart of the gospel. It's... God became flesh."
Awakening @ FUMC - 1 - Friday Night - Aug. 2018:
  • @1:13 - [Persecution of Jesus] "Truth - every day in their streets - Truth - total, crystal clear Truth, every day - and all they did was listen for what they didn't agree with and could never hear what He said - and killed Him and thought they were right. That's scary - that total Truth could stand in front of you every day and you can't hear it."
Awakening @ FUMC - 3 - Saturday Night - Aug. 2018:
  • @1:14 - "He's total Truth and they were sure He was a liar. He was total Truth - Jesus - and they were sure He was a liar... So they put Him on a cross. Wow, that's scary. That's frightening - that Truth , itself, could be standing in front of men and their motive decides what they hear."
Building Champions Men's Conference - Session 3 - 2018:

  • @1:41:39 - [Demonstrating talking with Jesus:] "You are God and You came in the flesh."
Griner Church - Friday night - 2/28/2020:
  • @10:20 - 12:18 - "He couldn't take a shortcut. And this impresses me... because He's God."
  • @34:58 - 35:28 - [He had to] "... submit Himself to live in a man's body. He was the Son of God. He was from the beginning. He always was with the Father. And now for 30 years He's just living as a man, waiting for the day..."
  • @38:20 - 39:50 - "He called Himself the Son of man. He must want you to see that. Come on, we're not doing the deity of God [referring to Jesus] injustice when we talk about Jesus coming as a man. A lot of people say, 'Yeah but He was 100% God.' And we want to fight. And nobody is saying anything wrong [i.e. different - i.e. Nobody is saying that He's not 100% God]. Jesus said that He was the Son of man. Paul said that there is one Mediator between God and man and it's THE Man. He didn't say the God. He said the Man. He's [Paul is] still making Him a Man but He is God. And He's the name above every name. And He's the Lord of all. But He is still a man."

Griner Church - Saturday Evening - 2/29/2020:

  • @7:41 - A lot of the emphasis on Jesus is His deity. He didn’t want you to emphasize His deity if you look at His language.



So you can clearly see a Jesus is God during His time on earth type thinking in Dan when he teaches about ...

  • Jesus raising Lazarus - The people at Lazarus’ tomb didn’t recognize Life - the person Life - when He was standing right in front of them. All they could see was death.
  • The Pharisees' persecution of Jesus - Though Jesus was Truth - the person Truth - the religious leaders didn’t recognize Him - even to the point of wanting to kill Him. Jesus was with them for quite a while and they completely rejected Him as a false teacher even though He was Truth.
  • Jesus being the revealed will of God - Because Jesus is God in the flesh, He is the definitive expression of the heart of the Father. When you’ve seen the Son in action, you’ve seen the heart of the Father.
  • The advent of Jesus - Jesus spent nine months in the womb of a woman though He was God the whole time.
  • John the Baptist's hesitancy to baptize Jesus - John was hesitant to Baptize Jesus because John understood who Jesus was - God in the flesh.
  • John the Baptist's imprisonment - John became unsure in prison despite the fact that John knew that Jesus was the Messiah.


And this collection is by no means exhaustive. Dan's references to the deity of Jesus are, for all practical purposes innumerable.


In addition, one of the very few books that Dan has recommended: When Heaven Invades Earth by Bill Johnson provides a clear comment on Jesus' divinity while on earth: "While He is 100% God, He chose to live with the same limitations that man would face once he was redeemed" - p.29. It would be hard to imagine recommending a book to students where you thought that the author's view of Christ's nature and the way He functioned on earth, was at odds with your own view. (At this time I am unable to locate Dan's recommendation although I remember it to be in HCSKL 2011 or 2010.)



Understanding the Objectionable Sounding Phrases


So if Dan really does believe that Jesus was God during Jesus' time on earth, how can Dan say things like: “He came as a man,” “He didn’t come as God…,” “If He came as God…” and “Don’t say, ‘Well, that was Jesus’” and other objectionable sounding phrases?


Context - The problem to be addressed


Knowing the problem that Dan is trying to address with these types of phrases would be helpful to interpreting their meaning. The comment below reveals the big problem that I believe Dan is working to remedy:


HCSKL 2011 Day 33 @ 30:12  - "One of the biggest mistakes we've made on the earth and in churches is we still... all we see Him as is God but He came as a man."


Here is the problem as I believe Dan sees it: that people view Jesus, for all practical purposes, as God only. Jesus' divinity is almost universally appreciated, even if not truly embraced, in the church and in our culture. In fact, so much emphasis has been given to Jesus’ full divinity that His full humanity has not been appreciated at all. Jesus’ full humanity gets crowded out of the hearts and minds of His people. I believe that Dan is just emphasizing, what has been underappreciated in our day, that Jesus was fully human.


Context - Dan's way of addressing the problem  


So when Dan says, "He came as a man." I believe Dan is just putting an emphasis on Jesus being fully human. And because He is fully human, we can follow Him (as we are commanded). Dan understands that Jesus being fully God is already well appreciated by the hearers.


And when Dan says things like, "He didn't come as God." or "If He came as God..." I believe Dan means this in the sense of what Jesus laid aside (Phil. 2) - in other words, that Jesus is God, but didn't come AS God - in the form of or reputation of God. Notice that Dan never says that Jesus was not God during His time on earth (or at any time for that matter). He only says that Jesus didn't come AS God.


When speaking about our ability, with God’s help, to follow Jesus, Dan often asks questions along the lines of: 

Here again, I believe that the point of these questions is not to deny the divinity of Christ but only to show that Jesus certainly did not come in the form or reputation of God. Dan wants to shake people out of seeing Jesus as God only and shake people into realizing that Jesus really was also fully human.


With the phrase, “Well, that was Jesus” again we see the problem that Dan is trying to address - that people widely appreciate the full divinity of Jesus but not His full humanity. What people really mean when they use this phrase is, “Well, that was God and because I’m not God, He can’t possibly expect me to do that.” People use Jesus' divinity as the excuse for why they cannot follow Jesus. So when Dan says, “Don’t say, ’Well, that was Jesus’” I don’t believe that he is trying to deny the divinity of Christ, which is already well appreciated by the hearers. Rather, Dan is confronting us with the full humanity of Christ - emphasizing what is underappreciated in our day - the fact that Jesus was also fully human. He was divine but He was also human. So there must be something there that we as humans, with God's help, can follow.



Does it seem logically inconsistent that God could submit Himself to live as a man and yet still really remain God? If so, then keep reading in related Objection 2.





 




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